Start a new topic

Nextion Intelligent HMI

Happy 2017 to all the forum users :)


 In Nextion Editor v.041 i can choose between:

-Normal

-Enchanted

-Intelligent (In Development)


Is it already known when the Intelligent HMI comes for sale on the market?

En what new functions will it have?


Best regards


When the Intelligent comes out - it will be better than the Enhanced but not certain as to when it will be coming out.  Please be aware that the Intelligent has not hit the market, even though some eBay'ers and other stores like AliExpress, and Banggood, are calling their Basic model the Intelligent ... Look for the Letter in the model  NX4024T032_011


The T series Basic Model has screen, touch, and SPI Flash

The K series Enhanced Model adds RTC, 1K EEPROM and 8 Digital GPIO


And the letter for the Intelligent series has not yet been assigned.

- not sure yet what great wonders await us ...

It's true that some sellers use the "intelligent" already, i did also notice ;-)
Lucky that it's easy to refer to the provided Nextion model names.

There are some features i would like, hopefully they are also on the list??

-Directly remote take-over the HMI screen when it's connected to a (secure) router. Then it might also needs a Ethernet connection. It's a big plus if the HMI can be controlled from all over the world via internet..

-A easy to use alarm message interface would be great too.
Now I'm struggling with 40 messages who need to be divided over 6 text-boxes. Starting at the highest textbox (t0) and every new message must show up one textbox below. For example if i have four messages:
t0 error 1
t1 error 2
t2 error 3
t3 error 4
And "t1 error 2" is Acknowledged, so disappearing,  t2 and t3 must shift one place up. But can not overwrite t0. If a new alarm shows up then it needs to come in t3. And so on..
Maybe it's because i'm inexperienced with the Nextion HMI, but it's quiet hard to me.
Of course all messages also needs to be logged, that's not the biggest deal.

-Master panel. Those panel(s) can contain as example 4 buttons who are showed on all pages where the selected master panel is selected. As example for my test program with only 5 pages and 4 same buttons i need 5 timers and 20 buttons all with the same code only for switch to the other screens and let a button flash on all pages in case of a alarm..

-Pop-up window.
I'ts a feature what i'm really missing. If i want to control a motor and see all details belonging to that motor then i want to click on the motor on the HMI. A pop-up window need to appear from where  i can control and monitor all the motor details. (It's quiet hard and messy to do it with a picture box and "invisible buttons, numbers, textboxes".)

Also i'm looking forward to the new generation of Nextion HMI's..
We will see what 2017 brings us..

Maybe if some of my wishes are available already, and i missed them because the lack of know-how then i can't wait to learn it :)

 

Directly remote take-over the HMI screen when it's connected to a (secure) router. Then it might also needs a Ethernet connection. It's a big plus if the HMI can be controlled from all over the world via internet.


- There certainly are a lot of threats and points of failure you introduce, one must really consider if you truly want to open that box.

- I can tell you that It is possible to deal with your 40 messages and 6 text-boxes.

- Master panel - once you have your skeleton set, pages can be copied.

- I consider popups poor planning, perhaps it is better to use status space.

I would perhaps consider thinking about what you have as a the building blocks, they are very capable of building extremely complex projects.  But it takes work and skill to pull of the complex.  Skill comes from doing the work, contemplating the complexities and testing theories of how it could be done even better. 

The work is just work - nothing special, just lots of it and time consuming repetition.  More often than not, the difference in the marketplace is that the losing competitor gives up because of this repetition.  The winner proves that continuing forward and chipping away piece by piece actually accomplishes what the competitor had been hoping for. 

Consider most computer programs.  Typically there really aren't that many base pieces.  And the majority of base pieces are really made up from other more simple base pieces.  But the more complex you want to make a project - it will usually always boil down to the work

My request, either for Intelligent or for future Enhanced, is for a better RTC. I have heard reports that it is inaccurate. For instance, the DS3231 is more accurate than the DS1307.


I would be careful with such generic statements ... RTC's are never accurate per se ... they can be calibrated as much as you like, but there are factors out which you can't influence ... and which let your RTC drift away ...

Humidity, humidity changes, temperature, temperature changes, emi, emi changes, voltage quality, voltage changes, voltage ripples ... and many more ... so, even a DS1307 in the right environment can be much more accurate than a DS3231 in the wrong one ...

That's why reliable time concepts are based on an external time synchronisation via NTP, GSM, GPS, DCF77 or similar ...

 



1 person likes this

Given the same environment, the DS3231 is more accurate than the DS1307. If we're going to have an RTC, it should, other things being equal, be a more accurate variety rather than a less accurate one. It could be the difference between a drift of several minutes a day (not bad for many purposes) and several minutes a year (good for many more purposes).


the bad side is only, you never have exactly same conditions ... you even can recognice differences between production loads of the same design ...

in theory you are right, but theory is not reality ...

MOST setups that I have read on the forum and around the Net with the Nextion involve a connecting MCU.  Now, I am certainly one of, perhaps highly driven developers to attempt to achieve many extensions of Nextion usage beyond the original HMI concept.  I love when I can accomplish in Nextion Logic without an MCU.


But seriously, if there are five such individuals that are attempting MCU-less HMI Nextion designs, I doubt it.  I doubt it very much - because a Human Machine Interface without the Machine is not much of an HMI, maybe more like HI! =) 


So seriously, if your project requires an Atomic clock, perhaps you should use an atomic clock.  If your setup has an MCU like the vast majority of HMI designs, it is way too easy to add you favorite method of time keeping into your MCU.  There is no need to change the Nextion.


The accuracy you seek is LOST immediately on having to transfer a timestamp via RX/TX.  The Nextion has 1K of eeprom on the Enhanced - and that seriously won't hold much high resolution timestamped data - again such accuracy is LOST when you try to write to the EEPROM.  So without such storage Nextion Side, you are having to send it over serial to timestamp an event that is captured by your MCU to begin with.


The DS1307 vs DS3231 is merely a peacock postering debate, as the application of these have lost any validity with all the external influences caused beyond user control.  To keep such better time, synchronization is needed.  An isolated RTC time source even if perfect and flawless is a time bubble around such device.  The only purpose of recording time is to compare when such event occurred, but those who receive that info are not in the isolated time bubble, they require it in relation to where they are -- synchronization.in itself moots the debate, as neither a DS1307 or a DS3231 will become the defacto standard.  AND Most certainly MY DS3231 will not be considered the world time synchronization source - nor your DS3231 ... so for all intense purposes, all but the synchronization source are merely slaves.


ALL RTCs have built in routines that allow for adjustments, when one doesn't perhaps then and only then, there maybe an RTC capable of performing the time keeping independently ... but to compare - you are right back to synchronization. If no compares are needed, any inaccuracies are mooted as none of this mattered.

Well, a number of straw men here. I never said anything about atomic clock accuracy, just that a more accurate RTC is suitable for more purposes than a less accurate one. In other projects, I have substituted a DS3231 for a DS1307 and found that it better suited my needs. YMMV.


Nor did I say anything at all about MCU-less Nextion design. An output-only device is not much more useful than an input-only device. iTead made the decision about adding the RTC to the Enhanced version. That would enable (not my purpose) the Nextion to be a stand-alone clock not much worse than some millions of other clocks in the world. A better RTC would make it a better clock.


I take people's points about clock inaccuracy relative to world standards--the old joke says, "A man with a watch knows what time it is; a man with two watches has no idea".


Good expression, the watches =)


My point is more that the DS3231 should be MCU side of that RX/TX pair and not Nextion side.


btw. when I look to the datasheets, I hardly can find any in technical detail which would let me make a dedicated statement about a "better" accuracy ...


pdf
(215 KB)
pdf
(824 KB)

"My point is more that the DS3231 should be MCU side of that RX/TX pair and not Nextion side"


I think there's a philosophy behind that "should", and it doesn't appear to be one which the iTead folks agreed with. But I will put my DS3231 on the MCU side.


"when I look to the datasheets, I hardly can find any in technical detail which would let me make a dedicated statement about a "better" accuracy"


Perhaps I should have been more precise and said, "People whom I credit have reported that the inexpensive DS3231 modules sold on ebay are significantly more accurate than similar DS1307 modules in similar environments". So I have thrown the onus on unnamed "people". I will still use an external RTC, and will still hope that some version of the Nextion gets a better one.


Perhaps the Intelligent series may have just that.

I am merely pointing out the difficulty in it being Nextion side.


If your MCU is timestamping from said RTC of which ever model

then you are hauling that across slow serial lines.


If you have Nextion side RTC for clock and it needs to be sync'd

you will mostly issue the update via an MCU command


Again this is all going back to where the best angle is for your code.


But you can certainly feel free to code as you wish, I am certainly

providing coding considerations that make sense for the user base.


This thread will be here in the future to provide reasonings.

 and there we are .... you are not talking about the chip itself, you talk about ready to use assembled modules.


And such modules already contains different external oscillators per se ...


Different cheap manufacturers also use different cheap oscillators with different tolerances ... and from outside you won't see which nature it is ... even they use a 32768 crystal, there are types of different accuracy out, 0.1%, 1%, ...


It makes not a lot sense to compare this RTC chips based on an already made 3. party PCB design.
DS3231.JPG
(14.9 KB)
DS1307.jpg
(40 KB)
Login or Signup to post a comment